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Author Topic: G20 Discussions  (Read 222 times)

t'Sade

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G20 Discussions
« on: June 29, 2010, 09:43:42 PM »

http://www.google.com/search?q=g20+discussions&hl=en&safe=off&prmd=nv&source=univ&tbs=nws:1&tbo=u&ei=mroqTOvXGcL88AbTubjdCA&sa=X&oi=news_group&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCEQsQQwAA
http://lexgill.com/2010/06/28/urgent-conditions-at-629-eastern-ave-illegal-immoral-dangerous/
http://news.nationalpost.com/2010/06/27/g20-police-arrest-more-than-50-at-university-of-toronto/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
http://news.nationalpost.com/2010/06/29/police-given-no-special-powers-during-g20-province/
http://news.nationalpost.com/2010/06/29/civil-liberties-association-g20-police-force-disproportionate-arbitrary-and-excessive/

G20 is a political conference going on right now in Canada. I'm not really interested in the conference itself, mainly because it is people with power talking to other people of power. I'm actually interested in the people protesting and the responses by the government. Of course, given the bias of the Internet, a lot of what I end up reading is all about police brutality, deplorable prison condition (not being charged with anything), and the general claim that they are taking out everyone in the street regardless if they are there for G20 or anything else.

The hard part with these things is bias. Obviously, if you were walking your dog and got arrested for 30+ hours, you'd be a bit bitter. On the other side, the police seem to be making up rules (the 5 meter thing, making the entire town a photo ID required section) and being generally inconsistent with their actions.

From one thing I heard, they spent a billion dollars trying to make G20 safe. I always question "what is safe" at that point. Safe like Baltimor blowing up little electronic things? Safe like China arresting dissents before the Olympics? Toronoto shipping homeless out of town before their Olympics? Or even the Republican National Party doing a mass arrest the days before the primaries a few years back?

From what I read, it doesn't seem unreasonable to have this brutality coupled with inconsistent handling. As Richard Daley (mayor of Chicago) proved, it is always easier to ask for forgiveness than to ask permission. Likewise, it is easier to arrest someone, never charge them, and let them sit until AFTER everything happens, and let them go without a charge. It keeps them out of the way and 99% of the people aren't going to sue the government in fear of reprisal.

I don't understand protesting in general. Well, I do. I don't feel I have any control over our government. It is people in power giving each other hand jobs as they want. The entire ACTA thing annoys the hell out of me, I hate DMCA, I hate this apparent obsession with Canada trying to implement the DMCA when thousands fought again it (something like 40-something out of 3-thousand posts were pro DMCA in that argument). But, as rumors say, the US businesses are really pushing DMCA.

G20 seems like that. It doesn't matter if 100, 1000 people protest something, it won't matter. But, sometimes I feel like I have to do *something*. I just don't know what that *something* is because I don't see anything that works.

Protesting a political conference? It doesn't really do anything. I don't know of any situation where arguing at a political conference actual does something. Yeah, protests when it isn't expected, useful. Getting into the discussions, useful. Yelling at people who refuse to listen to you... useless.

I can't tell you if the stories of brutality are true. Or the "double agents" from the police, or people being forced to sit in a cell for 30 hours with only a few meals and a cup of water. The problem is, given the general political climate, it seems plausible.

And that's the scary part.
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KK

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Re: G20 Discussions
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2010, 11:14:34 AM »

Once again I am happy to live in Germany.

Anyway, I think you're right that it is scary. I don't agree that protests are useless, though... but their usefulness depends on the number of people protesting.
A couple thousand people protesting... doesn't do anything. Politicians think in "# of voters". A few thousand voters don't matter - especially if they'd never vote for you in the first place.
But imagine the number of protesters rise to... say 1.000.000.
The problem is getting so many people to one place.

Of course, I am a cynic: Most people are too complacent to fight for their opinion ("fight" in the sense of being politically active within legal boundaries, of course).

And what's true for political discussions of people in power is as true for discussions of "normal" people: When all is said and done - there's usually more said than done.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2010, 11:16:11 AM by KK »
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t'Sade

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Re: G20 Discussions
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2010, 06:15:31 PM »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G-20_major_economies

Thing is, G-20 is an international discussion. The summit represents, I guess, the top 20 or so financial superpowers in this world. Germany and France are both members of this group. They have a summit, usually to talk about money around the world, and people protest. But, it really isn't about voters more than countries with a lot of power deciding how the future will be. Of course, there is always the question of who is the "power behind the throne" as it were.
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